Do you think the S1000RR guys wanna hang with K dudes?

[Ed F K]

Will there even be enough web traffic (due low sales volumes) of the bike to support a separate site?... Not for a long time... at best, maybe never.

Also, the Japanese liter bike crowd will go where the best performance is... if this bike cleary beats the Japanese, even at a couple of grand more... it will be winner. If it does not have a clear edge, or continuouly improve... its history. The crowd will say: If the performance isnt there... and also there is nothing unique about it except the label... the question becomes, why buy it? So it must be better or die.

[caratz]

My point exactly, but you stated it a lot better.

[joe]

I would follow the integration route if it was my decision. Bottom-line is that it remains a BMW superbike with strong links to the K-bikes.

I could argue that the K-bikes also speak to different target-groups, i.e. naked bikes, vs (sport) tourers?

Either way, I'm confident the new site will kick butt if you follow that route

[SHIVA]

I got an education today. A lot of popular discussion forums are owned by Motorcycle.com.

what a racket! S

[stxman4]

However, the 25 year old SQUID who is just gonna come to BMW because of the S1KRR, most probably wouldn't want to hang with the K guys.

S

Hey I am that 25 (well 26 now) year old squid who came to bmw for the k12s from a r6! I say keep the site mixed as it will help us welcome our "younger riders" and indoctrinate them into the bmw family just like I was. As the s1000rr riders grow older they will most likely want to "move up" in bikes and this way they'll know where to turn to. I guess I just matured a little earlier than most in terms of what I wanted in a bike, which is why the k12s is the perfect bike for me.

-Mike

[scrannel]

I'm a misanthrope anyway. But, in this case, the more the more interesting.

[SHIVA]

stxman, thanks for your comment.

Check out this image that a member on Gixxer.com put... boy do they look close...

[Eka]

How close it could be.

Of course aerodynamics and other physical laws says something about how it should look. Looks like gixxer has a little less wheelbase. Lets see how much difference is after they get customers bikes out.

[SHIVA]

you can't go by pictures as for wheelbase.

you can easily stretch the pic of the gixxer to make it longer than the Beemer. this is a highly inaccurate way of telling differences, but it's fun! S

[SHIVA]

anyone is following the thread on Gixxer.com, it's really informative.

http://www.gixxer.com/forums/showthread ... 928&page=2

and two others:
http://www.1000rr.net/forums/showthread ... ost1211684

http://www.r1-forum.com/forums/showthre ... 921&page=2

[Daniel]

Didn't read all the feedback, I thought many of these youngsters may need some guidance, moral, technical, the responsibilities as a bmw (hot!!) owner. Besides with one of the smallest share of the motorcycle ownership, there's a great advantage to stick with their own kind (bmw?), I am hoping it would be that way.

Regards

[SHIVA]

guidance, moral, technical

if you go that direction, you'll get them pissed. no young rider on a 1000cc rocket want to be told how to ride. you should know that.

if we do keep all BMW inline 4s under one roof, I'll make sure the K dudes don't insult the younger "S" dudes (just because they want to pull a wheelie on public roads). You got to let them be.... S

[CSW]

Correct me if I am wrong, but when the K-S bikes came out I seem to remember a magazine review with headline " BMW K1200 S - Busa beater ? " The K bikes are aimed at the sport side right, so the new 1000rr is sportier yet....I say keep 'em right here. BMW is a BMW.

Plus most of us ride other BMW'S and or other brands.

Harley and Harley riders don't separate Sporsters from Softails, Dynas, or V-Rods they are all Harleys.

At 52 years old I'd own a new 1000rr if money and my wife would alow yet one more bike in the stable.

[Roger2010]

I would guess it may take some time for the new bike to win over converts from Jap bike owners. I think the first buyers will come from the BMW ranks. If the bike is really good it will still take a couple of years to win over converts.
I also think any one looking to read up about the new bikes would automatically look at an existing BMW site.
So can you tell which way I'm thinking? Set it up here and give it some time.
If it attracks the hordes then give it a seperate place here.

[Paratus]

As I am new to this community, please allow me to first introduce myself: Shawn from Toronto, Canada.

Much has been discussed in response to this initial post, and I relate to positions on both sides of the argument.

The loyal following of BMW Motorrad are drawn to the innovation, excellence in design, persnickety attention to detail, and ultimately the pursuit of mechanical perfection that is only possible when the design team and engineers are as passionate as they are educated and talented. This has been the case since 1923, and in my opinion, will not change. I believe BMW is expanding on new target markets, but it is ultimately targeting the same demographic.

While I am not sure this is an international policy, BMW in Toronto will not sell a high powered bike to a new rider. BMW Motorrad here insists that the rider has at least two years of experience before selling high displacement bikes, and here demonstrates their conviction that the rider is the most important component of the bike. Only a "higher echelon" of rider will be drawn to the unique standards and character of BMW Motorrad, which seems to be the very personification of "mature." (and no, mature is not at all synonymous with boring Further to this, any premium in cost will be regarded as the price of admission to a superior product by the same demographic who currently ride or drive BMWs (or would like too).

The aforementioned will likely be issues of discouragement to other demographics which are likely to focus on cost and youth-image over quality and design. An exception to this rule will be the hard core "head bangers" who salivate at the thought of a rumored 1:1 power to weight ratio. As the majority of these track day stars are very talented riders, I would see them as an asset to this forum - not an impediment. While super-sport riders no doubt belong to a younger demographic than currently exists on this site, I am confident that through ownership they will begin to appreciate the same qualities that have made BMW revered since 1923. Just as maturity is not synonymous with lethargy, youth should not be held synonymous with immaturity. I am confident that a shared site will be great place for all BMW riders.

While I personally fall into a young/new rider demographic with only 3 years under my belt - I feel privileged to share information and opinions with such a wealth of experienced and seasoned BMW riders internationally. I believe that many "under 30" will share this sentiment with me.

Looking forward to many years of riding and learning!!

Shawn

[Illuvatar]

Hello Paratus and welcome to the community!

While I am impressed with how BMW Motorrad up there is looking out for new riders, and I whole heartily agree with that policy, I am even more impressed by your first post!

Wow man! You said a mouthfull!

[SHIVA]

paratus, welcome to the forum. sorry we didn't catch you soon enough. thanks to illuvatar's reminder. S

[SHIVA]

I have come to a conclusion on this thread: I am betting that the S1000RR will sell in smaller quantities similar to the 1098. Maybe in 15 -20 years if BMW continues updating it every 2 years, that it might become acceptable in the same level as the Japanese. But certainly not in the first 7 years.

Also, keep in mind, these bikes will be (in relation to the Japanese) expensive to maintain, and specially the parts prices. Even if BMW sells them at 13K, or so they claim, they'll cost more than the Japanese to maintain. Also, add to that your typical SQUID wouldn't typically walk into a BMW dealership. The same way, they don't walk into a MV or Ducati dealership. The Japanese liter class and 600s are great specimens, that provide the ideal package. Best performance, overall design, technology, pricing, value, service costs, reputation, community, aftermarket parts, peer pressure driven me-too ownership habits, best racing history and best R&D, and overall bang for the money in the whole planet for anything with an engine. They won 20 years ago. These riders don't want exclusivity, the same way H-D riders don't want exclusivity. They want to blend in with two very popular herds.

I have been thinking about this for a long time, mainly to decide whether a separate, S1000RR forum is needed. My decision at this point is that, it wouldn't be. Because we'll not get the typical SQUID rider. We'll get mature BMW-Centric riders who want the premium experience and do not want to blend in, who wouldn't mind at all to share the overall forum platform with the K guys. I think the K and S, the way we have it, is the right approach.

Which of course, is a confirmation of what you guys have been saying all along... That's why I respect you guys so much. S

[William-K1200GT]

Shiva
I agree with IEHawk, the name says it all "bmwsuperbikes.com" - a superbike is 1000cc, bigger is hyperbike, but also a "super bike"

I chatted to a guy at work with a Fireblade, about 30-ish, he has driven Blades for years and is waiting to see what the "S" is like
This after I showed him that my bike is not much heavier than his blade and the S will be lighter than his
He assumed, by looks, that my GT is over 300kg
Motorrad here offers free coffee, some "other" shops have pubs selling burgers and beer - in the showroom
When I asked him he says he used to go there but he is past that stage now, wife and kid
He used to service his bike himself, now he is too busy with work and family
People like him might change to BMW and enjoy reading what other BMW riders say
I can easily see him moving to the S and then the KS in a few years time

This is the site for all BMW Super Bikes
Because of the exchange rate, that is my 20 (RSA) cents worth

[Paratus]

Illuvatar and Shiva, thank you for the warm welcome!

[Streaker]

Personal opinion, keep them together! I have ridden K bikes since 1999, ok three of them. First K1200rs 45000km (bad accident) second K1200rs (85000 plus change km Traded in on next bike) K1200r 26500km (4500 on the track with three falls) Next bike a S1000rr only because it is more track based but this forum is the most technically informative ever and I love it. I only hope the S stays part because in a few years time when I am tired of track riding I will be on the ultimate riding machine again which by then might be a K2000s.